Peggy has had one of the most illustrious careers at NASA.
Peggy Orenstein's here to discuss her new book “Cinderella Ate My Daughter: Dispatches from the Frontlines of the New Girlie-Girl Culture” which I hear is going to be making
Peggy Orenstein: Thank you.
Peggy Orenstein: Um.
Peggy Orenstein: I just have to say first of all I'm feeling so old media sitting -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Peggy Orenstein: here like she's reading my credits and I'm saying, "Oh God like you
Peggy Orenstein: that every little girl had to be a princess and be swathed in pink for the first four years of her life so, or five years.
Peggy Orenstein: I mean I look at girls from infancy to sort of through the tween years and the last chapter in the book is about social media --
Peggy Orenstein: but I think is where we intersect.
Peggy Orenstein: Right.
Peggy Orenstein: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Peggy Orenstein: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: so that that implication is considered.
Peggy Orenstein: that I, it's really easy to look at girls and victimization -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Yes.
Peggy Orenstein: but while I was doing this chapter and we're gonna talk about bullying Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: and that sort of thing and looking at all of that, one of my friend's son's got emailed to him, he's 14, a photo by one of his classmates of her naked from
Peggy Orenstein: as a media researcher -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: how you think about this, but when I talked to researchers on sexuality and desire, what I got back was that, for girls, that sexual entitlement and sexual
Peggy Orenstein: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: Is sexual entitlement -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Okay.
Peggy Orenstein: as a performance or is -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Performance.
Peggy Orenstein: it yeah.
Peggy Orenstein: Well and boys too.
Peggy Orenstein: Yeah.
Peggy Orenstein: Um.
Peggy Orenstein: Well I suppose because otherwise it's a tacit approval in a way too if you don't comment.
Peggy Orenstein: something, then it comes off as a tacit approval of that thing.
Peggy Orenstein: Right. Kaveri Subrahmanyam: use occurs in the privacy of their bedroom -- Peggy Orenstein: Right.
Peggy Orenstein: Right.
Peggy Orenstein: Now I'm depressed.
Peggy Orenstein: “It Gets Better”.
Peggy Orenstein: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: Right, right.
Peggy Orenstein: No.
Peggy Orenstein: No, no.
Peggy Orenstein: because we didn't have Maytag back then and -- we had to boil clothes to get them clean -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Right.
Peggy Orenstein: so we didn't like to have color.
Peggy Orenstein: at this point.
Peggy Orenstein: And in addition you have “Cinderella” and “Sleeping Beauty” -- the Disney movies -- they're in blue and -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: It's true.
Peggy Orenstein: I didn't think about, I hadn't 'til you pointed it out remembered about is it Michael, Michael's in pink?
Peggy Orenstein: And -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: the younger child.
Peggy Orenstein: the little one yeah, the one ?
Peggy Orenstein: Yeah.
Peggy Orenstein: not blue so much, but pink came into its own -- Kaveri Subrahmanyam: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: as being all defining of girls' younger experience.
Peggy Orenstein: and it's getting narrower.
Peggy Orenstein: Um-hum.
Peggy Orenstein: And I always like to say that in this book I really present myself as a fellow traveler.
Peggy Orenstein: everything I've been fighting against for the last 30 years apparently can't.
Peggy Orenstein: between girls and boys when left to flourish in their separate cultures become big gaps.